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Alan Cotterell
In a time out state
Victoria
421 Posts |
 Posted - 20 Jan 2010 : 3:28:49 PM
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| I'll give you a candid reply. Your are better off joining the biggest club you can find. If you are in Melbourne, Hartwell is the way to go. Forget rules and logbooks for a couple of years, and ride at their club meetings. Make as many friends as you can with similar bikes to your own. Get together with them at Champions Ride Days and have a derbi. If you don't make it obvious what you are doing, you'll get away with it. Also Friday practice at Winton can be used the same way. |
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john feakes
Advanced Member
Victoria
791 Posts |
Posted - 21 Jan 2010 : 09:20:01 AM
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Duncan, as I see it there is no reason why your bike should not be easily log booked as P3.
I would suggest that you get in touch with P.C.R.A. N.S.W. and I am sure they will guide you in the right direction.
The biggest problem you face is a lack of tracks to ride it on up there.
You are not wrong, it is not easy for someone wishing to "dip a toe".
The biggest problem is that it is hard for an outsider to find the entrance to our secret society. We don't, won't or can't advertise our activities to the general public so the outsider remains outside, unaware of what is happening.
We need to change this.
Cheers, John |
125 RIDERS' ALLIANCE
A wise person simplifies the complicated, a fool complicates the simple. |
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john
Forum Moderator
Victoria
3130 Posts |
Posted - 21 Jan 2010 : 10:25:12 AM
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The HRR is a better club for P3 bikes in NSW or even my club, HMRAV which has a number of NSW based members. Alan idea is not bad, but I dont agree about the secret society that JF talks about.
keep in touch with your local body M NSW id based there. |
John Daley Sidecar #68
' there are those who do, those who dont do and those who undo. We must lampoon the latter." |
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john feakes
Advanced Member
Victoria
791 Posts |
Posted - 22 Jan 2010 : 12:00:28 PM
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| My understanding is that HRR is no longer active. |
125 RIDERS' ALLIANCE
A wise person simplifies the complicated, a fool complicates the simple. |
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Historic
Level 2 Member
New South Wales
46 Posts |
Posted - 22 Jan 2010 : 2:03:01 PM
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On the ball again John, HRR still going, still meeting, still active.
Historic
Life Member HRR |
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john feakes
Advanced Member
Victoria
791 Posts |
Posted - 22 Jan 2010 : 2:29:51 PM
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| How many race meetings are they running in 2010? |
125 RIDERS' ALLIANCE
A wise person simplifies the complicated, a fool complicates the simple. |
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Alan Cotterell
In a time out state
Victoria
421 Posts |
Posted - 23 Jan 2010 : 08:00:31 AM
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| What are the contact details and URL for the HRR? |
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racer7
Level 2 Member
67 Posts |
Posted - 24 Jan 2010 : 7:54:11 PM
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From the results from Philip Island, it seems with 1980's bikes entering the fray, next will be 1990's bikes, so there'll be no need to boost numbers.......it's happening already .
Purists will just have to weep no doubt
Any of you going to the Barry Sheene?
racer7 |
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john feakes
Advanced Member
Victoria
791 Posts |
Posted - 24 Jan 2010 : 8:39:36 PM
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| History being modernised? |
125 RIDERS' ALLIANCE
A wise person simplifies the complicated, a fool complicates the simple. |
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john
Forum Moderator
Victoria
3130 Posts |
Posted - 25 Jan 2010 : 11:32:09 AM
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| In Victoria we are encouraging P6 bikes to race at modern meetings, so we still have room for more of the older ones. |
John Daley Sidecar #68
' there are those who do, those who dont do and those who undo. We must lampoon the latter." |
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john feakes
Advanced Member
Victoria
791 Posts |
Posted - 25 Jan 2010 : 1:02:21 PM
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I imagine that as our older members depart the scene the younger ones will take over and their view of an historic bike will no doubt be what I think of as a modern bike.
It's all Charlie Darwin's fault! |
125 RIDERS' ALLIANCE
A wise person simplifies the complicated, a fool complicates the simple. |
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GD66
Senior Member
Western Australia
390 Posts |
Posted - 26 Jan 2010 : 5:47:20 PM
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| Nothing wrong with that at all. If P3 500s are supposedly the guts of historic meetings, it's up to their owners to get 'em out and gallop them, or else they can't complain they are being usurped. Island Classic used to get 40 entries in this class, this year 25 entries and 19 faced the starter in the first leg. P5 Unlimited had 75 entries : as an organiser, what would you do ? |
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john feakes
Advanced Member
Victoria
791 Posts |
Posted - 27 Jan 2010 : 08:00:20 AM
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No argument from me G.D., the writing is on the wall.
I am sure it is far easier (and cheaper) to run a P5 unlimited bike than, say, a P3 Manx. Also, and perhaps far more relevant, is the fact that those of us who grew up with P3 bikes and have a fond spot for them, are now generally P2 models and are running out of enthusiasm. It seems that we are heading for an historic superbike series with the rest being support classes.
Perhaps there will be a split in the future with P2, P3 and P4 struggling to survive in one camp and P5, P6 and P7 running in different events, possibly as part of the modern bike events.
Time will tell.
Cheers, John |
125 RIDERS' ALLIANCE
A wise person simplifies the complicated, a fool complicates the simple. |
Edited by - john feakes on 27 Jan 2010 08:08:56 AM |
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john feakes
Advanced Member
Victoria
791 Posts |
Posted - 27 Jan 2010 : 08:07:37 AM
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Mr Historic, you have gone very quiet again. Sniping from the bushes is not constructive.
I am still waiting for your response to my question.
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125 RIDERS' ALLIANCE
A wise person simplifies the complicated, a fool complicates the simple. |
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oldonk
Level 2 Member
Australian Capital Territory
84 Posts |
Posted - 27 Jan 2010 : 11:48:56 AM
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I see no reason why P2 cannot survive.
There are old bangers out there that dont need original tanks etc that cna be built from rubbish and get raced. Not all P2 parts are expensive. I guess some cant be bothered to try a build like that.But anyway back to the topic, more promotion via magazines etc may help and personel promotion by racers themselves is a vital part of the program. |
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Historic
Level 2 Member
New South Wales
46 Posts |
Posted - 27 Jan 2010 : 3:59:53 PM
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Hmmm sniping from the bushes? Don't really know how I could possibly be more in the front line (to continue your military reference) but I'm sure you'll tell me. I've posted about 14 or 15 times on this site. Mr Feakes over 400. So far from going quite I'm about on target for commenting. I normally only do when mentioned in despatches (military reference again Johnny Boy) I haven't bothered answering your disingenuos enquiry about the HRR because you seem to have all the answers. With this topic now into its 5th page and more than 70% of the posts shared between Mr Feakes and Al I agree with olddonk's comment "anyway back to the topic" on promoting the sport. Please stop hijacking every forum stream to keep pushing your own agenda.
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Alan Cotterell
In a time out state
Victoria
421 Posts |
Posted - 27 Jan 2010 : 5:45:11 PM
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| There is no better class than P3 500s. It should be everybody's ambition to ride a manx at least once in their lives. However when Peter Lord and Derek Picard started this game in October 1973, they claimed an objective of preserving the old racing bikes. Personally I love every factory produced production racer, and I believe every one of them should be preserved and nurtured. Last year's MotoGP bike would be a good investment, even if 'historic racing' never caters for them! I suggest we need to keep our eye on the ball, and make some allowance for preservation of genuine production racers, even if some people get paranoid about 'moderns' racing at historic meetings. In 10 years time, a 2008 MotoGP bike will be an important part of history! It will be just as revered as a 1962 500cc Manx Norton! And riding it will be every bit as interesting. |
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john
Forum Moderator
Victoria
3130 Posts |
Posted - 27 Jan 2010 : 10:09:27 PM
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Back to the point about promotion, can anybody remember that was the topic.
I am thinking of asking david for approval to trash any comment taht is not topic specific. Start your own threads rather than ruin a worthwhile one.
Now the topic is attraction of pre 1980 bikes to the pre 1980 bike races, ideas please gentleman.
Dont waste my time with later model stuff it can be dealt with in another topic. |
John Daley Sidecar #68
' there are those who do, those who dont do and those who undo. We must lampoon the latter." |
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john feakes
Advanced Member
Victoria
791 Posts |
Posted - 28 Jan 2010 : 07:38:34 AM
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I think we all know how to attract more competitors but prefer to ignore what seems too hard in the hope that someone will produce a magic wand.
How about...........
1/. Make it cheaper to compete (one day events/entry).
2/. Promote outside the normal channels.
3/. More come and try days (with a display of race bikes and riders to chat to)
5/. Try to source bikes available for purchase.
6/. Encourage retired riders to come back (discounted entry fees for oaps).
7/. Set up a workshop to help newcomers with bike preparation.
8/. Set up a directory of specialist businesses.
9/. Promote this site as the hub of information.
10/.Establish better inter club communication.
Well, there are a few ideas, I'm sure others will come up with more.
I nearly forgot, the Broadford Bonanza would be a good platform for a display of race bikes and a come and chat tent, it could well attract people who don't normally attend race meetings.
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125 RIDERS' ALLIANCE
A wise person simplifies the complicated, a fool complicates the simple. |
Edited by - john feakes on 28 Jan 2010 07:47:32 AM |
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GD66
Senior Member
Western Australia
390 Posts |
Posted - 28 Jan 2010 : 08:06:06 AM
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All very good ideas, John. (By the way, did you spot the CB125 out racing at the Island Classic ?).
Regarding the promotion of this site as an info hub, it has had some success in this sphere already, with the flow of info and tips. Unfortunately the thread hijacks don't really help, chatting to fellow members at the Island revealed they are reluctant to get too involved as they see the recurrence of common themes.
What about a set of stickers with the site's address to give out at race meetings for use on helmets, fairings, toolboxes etc to spread the word? Must say, I've been pleased to see the flow of new members joining in the last few months, I feel things are on the up. |
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Alan Cotterell
In a time out state
Victoria
421 Posts |
Posted - 28 Jan 2010 : 08:33:49 AM
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| Are you saying that my comment about late model production racers was a 'thread hijack'? I'd suggest that one reason that people get involved in historic racing is that they are 'collector enthusiasts'. If you wanted to get into historic racing - what would YOU buy? Somebody else's problems, or would you buy something 'modern' like an 80s TZ, and simply wait? In the 70s certain HMRAV members voted to not support any bike made after 1962. That sort of thing is idiotic and non-progessive. It effectively stops growth of the sport! |
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john
Forum Moderator
Victoria
3130 Posts |
Posted - 28 Jan 2010 : 08:59:48 AM
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What happenned in the 70's has been over ridden with new members.
I am in Historic racing with a 1972 sidecar, I have been looking at building a BSA 350 from a collection of bits I have in a shed that need to have an engine added. The frame is nota BSA, it would be a collection of bits model.
Alan I would not be aiming to win on any solo I build, I get enjoyment from the build and then seeing how it goes, followed by what improvement I can generate. |
John Daley Sidecar #68
' there are those who do, those who dont do and those who undo. We must lampoon the latter." |
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Alan Cotterell
In a time out state
Victoria
421 Posts |
Posted - 28 Jan 2010 : 3:57:48 PM
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| John, there's nothing wrong with a 'bitsa' as long as it at least looks the part, and keeps up with the lead group in its capacity class. Period 3 is the premier class, and as long as you don't mind the problem of getting a decent front brake, it's well worthwhile. The trouble is that there aren't so many old bikes lying around in bits anymore. In any case they're probably better restored and vintage registered. For beginners,you'd be better off buying a two valve jawa engine, triumph box, copy featherbed frame, commando brake. It'll probably end up costing the same! |
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john
Forum Moderator
Victoria
3130 Posts |
Posted - 28 Jan 2010 : 4:49:19 PM
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You and I have dioscused this in the past, and I am trying to show there are alternatives to Concours bikes.
Bitsa's are achievable.
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John Daley Sidecar #68
' there are those who do, those who dont do and those who undo. We must lampoon the latter." |
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freddie60
Level 1 Member
New South Wales
7 Posts |
Posted - 28 Jan 2010 : 9:28:27 PM
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How to boost race numbers? well P3 bikes of any size are well out of my budget,
so I have a P4 350, P5 250 and a P5 400.
Problem? They are all on the same grid at the Vic Titles.
We need more individual races |
Wunof Machine Shoppe |
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GD66
Senior Member
Western Australia
390 Posts |
Posted - 28 Jan 2010 : 9:37:52 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by glen20
Are you saying that my comment about late model production racers was a 'thread hijack'?
No, I'm saying if you had the time to sit down and analyse all the threads on the Orange Website (copyright AH), there would be an ongoing and repetitive theme interspersed throughout, based on the need to make all classic racing at state and national level fit your narrow requirements. The fact that you are unwilling to give any credit to successful clubs for their formats, or acknowledge that racers are happy to compete under existing race regulations, is underlined by your single-minded skill to derail any topic to push your bandwagon. I've never met you, and for all I know you may well be a good bloke, but until you get out from behind the keyboard and actually venture along to a few meetings and run your ideas past current competitors, you can't expect much in the way of a favourable response, or even support for your concepts. Who knows, you may even enjoy the racing you witness.
PS : 360 entries at Phillip Island, and no mention of class re-structuring from anyone. Get the idea ?  |
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john
Forum Moderator
Victoria
3130 Posts |
Posted - 28 Jan 2010 : 9:37:52 PM
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Put simply the HMRAV cannot run events for each possible bike.
We accept input from racers regularly and we try and steer a direction that gets the most amount of bikes on the track with events that are at least 1/2 full.
You can always approach the club in writing with any idea.
Admittedly we do have trouble accommodating racers with multiple bikes but we try.So please write and present your case and get others to back you as well, that is the only way we can gauge the real situation. |
John Daley Sidecar #68
' there are those who do, those who dont do and those who undo. We must lampoon the latter." |
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