| Author |
 Topic  |
|
acotrel
Advanced Member
Victoria
2147 Posts |
 Posted - 25 Oct 2004 : 6:36:57 PM
|
| If you need racing numbers, there is a Honda dealer on the Old Hume Highway just as you go out of Benalla towards Winton, on the RHS. He has them available. Its 11 Km from the circuit. So you should be able to get them on the Friday after or before practice, if you need them. |
Is your machine authentic or merely eligible? |
 |
|
|
David
Site Administrator
Australia
999 Posts |
Posted - 25 Oct 2004 : 7:02:59 PM
|
It might be Winton's business as you put it Alan, but it is the riders right to know who they are riding against (or who they are not riding against).quote:
Originally posted by acotrel
The numbers of entries in each class are Winton's business, however since the trend so far has been to talk this meeting down, I doubt they will be very forthcoming with info.
It wasn't up to this site to put the meeting down, so why should it suffer? If information was more forthcoming from Winton, then it would of been given a better reaction from the users of this site.
We hope that you have plenty of Historic riders at the 2004 Australian Historic Championships and not mainly BEARS.quote:
Originally posted by acotrel
All I can say is there are plenty of entries, and this meeting should be great!
We also hope it is great at the 2004 Australian BEARS (sorry, Historic) Championships.
See what I mean, Winton do not provide details in a public, yet on the BEARS site they are publically declearing the following: You must be logged in to see this link.. So which is it, the 2004 Australian Historic Championships or BEARS Nationals? Or is the 2004 Australian Historic Championships just another stuff up?
If you do not like what I wrote there, then I am sorry, but the week-end is being advertised as 2 seperate events and someone isn't telling the truth, so which is it Winton? 
|
Regards,
David
Webmaster & Owner of Classic Motorcycling Australia
Quote: I thought I wanted a career, turns out I just wanted to be paid. |
|
|
|
Alan
Forum Moderator
Western Australia
353 Posts |
Posted - 25 Oct 2004 : 10:31:40 PM
|
Alan You have again missed the point. When I mentioned race numbers it was because we have already sent our bikes as is to Winton. To be scrutineered on Friday we have to be race ready including numbers, if we do not receive notification of our race numbers prior to Friday please let me know how we can get through scrutineering without having any problems.
On the other subject about us talking the meeting down I think that whoever is the organiser at Winton should take note of the comments made and understand the reasons behind the comments. All we need is to have the information provided to us in what has been the norm over the past 5 or 6 years and all of this would go away. Maybe the reason you seem to take offence is because you know that we are basically right and you dont know how to defend the current situation.
Alan |
|
|
|
acotrel
Advanced Member
Victoria
2147 Posts |
Posted - 27 Oct 2004 : 1:03:46 PM
|
What is the 'current situation' regarding numbers? There's nothing to defend, most riders will probably get the numbers they asked for.
If you have a problem ring Heather.
In any case, if you get knocked back during scrutineering on Friday morning , simply cruise into town and buy some more numbers It'll take you twenty minutes. |
Is your machine authentic or merely eligible? |
|
|
|
Alan
Forum Moderator
Western Australia
353 Posts |
Posted - 27 Oct 2004 : 9:52:02 PM
|
Nice answer you have once again highlighted the problems with the attitude being shown towards competitors.
Just cruise into town and maybe miss the first practice. We are not getting much track time for our dollar as it is and paying through the nose for what we do get and we apparently cant get what is considered normal communications.
I give up, I will be there but if I lived locally I reckon I would have spat the dummy by now.
Alan |
|
|
|
Former Member
deleted
120 Posts |
Posted - 28 Oct 2004 : 12:49:08 AM
|
| What do you expect nice guy Alan, the few guys we know that are going still havn't heard back from winton so your not all alone, the only way they still know the place exists is coz the cheques have been cashed. when are they going see a race program and find out who there up against and even if there up against anyone. at the risk of getting shot down, murdered by a commish or otherwise black banned, winton and Ross Martin & co have proven all of themselfs totally incompetant, i rekon it will be ok by everyone if you have a big dummy spit when you get there but winton will probably try to charge you some money to do it. |
Jayne |
|
|
|
acotrel
Advanced Member
Victoria
2147 Posts |
Posted - 28 Oct 2004 : 6:21:52 PM
|
Jayne, all you guuys who have been following the progress of the 2004 Historic Championships will be glad to know that acceptance notices will be sent out in the next couple of days. A Schedule of Events will be made available both to all entrants and on a web site.
There is a total of 242 entries which have been accepted and 22 of these involve cross-entries between classes.
The programme has been developed to ensure that the minimum field is about twenty, many events have fields of over thirty machines. From memory, the BEARS is running a full grid (40), as is the 500cc Classic/Post Classic grid. Foregotten Era 251 to 1300 is also running a large field.
The rationalisation of classes has meant that there are 9 types of event, and they will be run five times. So every entrant will get at least 5 rides. Most races are 6 laps of the 3 Km course, some are 4. There are about 5 practice sessions (including qualifying).
Careful planning has meant that in only a couple of cases some riders will have consecutive rides.
Some of the entries are interesting. Wally Campbell will be riding Brook Henry's Ducati in Period 4. Should be hard to beat. In the 1984 Six Hour he consistently made up 5 bike lengths in every corner, lapping in the same times as Wayne Gardner who was riding a 1000cc Honda. Wally was on a VF750R.
Talking of A graders. Rudy Skenk who is Stuart Loly's main opposition in Period 5 has lent his McIntosh Kawasaki to Steve Martin to ride in BEARS. The entrant is actually Bob Martin Engineering. Steve runs very well in the Vic Road Race Championships on a TZ250. I suggest the NSW guys will find him very hard to beat.
I sincerely believe anyone who has entered will have a top time. THe only problem for many will be running out of steam because of the number of rides and the distances involved in the races.
I apologise for the previous lack of info. Winton did not want to release a schedule of events until the optimum way of running the meeting was found. I suggest everyone will be satisfied with the number of racing kilometers involved, and the level of competition in each race. I think you'll have fun at this meeting. |
Is your machine authentic or merely eligible? |
|
|
|
mboddy
Level 2 Member
Australian Capital Territory
![]()
26 Posts |
Posted - 28 Oct 2004 : 7:13:58 PM
|
The information is too late for me. Entries closed on the 16th.
I couldn't justify the cost for only three races on one bike.
But ten practice sessions and ten races on two bikes sounds great.
A pity they don't take late entries.
Mark.
|
|
|
|
David
Site Administrator
Australia
999 Posts |
Posted - 28 Oct 2004 : 7:18:33 PM
|
Thanks for the information Winton (and Alan)quote:
Originally posted by acotrel
A Schedule of Events will be made available both to all entrants and on a web site.
Can this site please have a full Schedule of Events to place on this site?
You know my e-mail address Alan which you can pass on to who ever at Winton race track.
I would also like to get a copy of the results for each day so I can also publish them to promote the sport once again. Is this at all possible?
|
Regards,
David
Webmaster & Owner of Classic Motorcycling Australia
Quote: I thought I wanted a career, turns out I just wanted to be paid. |
|
|
|
Former Member
deleted
120 Posts |
Posted - 28 Oct 2004 : 9:13:50 PM
|
| Well that looks more promising than it was going to be but a bit more info would be good. seeing as the bears are no consequence to anyone except themselfs and you since you reported them first over the classic guys, then the real figure is 202 entries, then there will be the guys with more than one bike entered so the true number of guys is probably around 180, thats not very good. a few guys who have read this dont believe the number of rides your saying coz they rekon it cant fit in the time or its just bull****. i hope winton hasnt tried to chuck in more races than is possible coz you'll look even more incompetant if you cant run to your new program. considering the entries arnt all that flash the big question everyone asking is who gets to ride for a championship and who is just putting money in wintons pocket, you should have answered that the day after entries closed. and just for my own info, a jap kawasaki in the bears, makes bears seem even more stupid than they already are. anyway its looks like sites like this have forced winton give guys a better deal so thats good. hope everyone has a great time. |
Jayne |
|
|
|
Alan
Forum Moderator
Western Australia
353 Posts |
Posted - 28 Oct 2004 : 9:31:53 PM
|
It would be nice to think that the acceptance notices will arrive before I leave on Tuesday so I will know what to expect when I arrive. I suppose I could stop being so stubborn and phone to find out but I did send a stamped and addressed envelope for this purpose
Interesting question, how can a Kawasaki run in Bears? and for that matter I thought Macintosh was a Kiwi so nothing fits or does it have British, European or American handlebar grips or something.
Nice to see you back snoozer and so polite as well. Well done.
Alan Sidecar (still dont know number) WA |
|
|
|
Former Member
deleted
72 Posts |
Posted - 28 Oct 2004 : 10:25:33 PM
|
| that macintosh is a home made copy of a kawasaki powered bike first made in 1981. i think the reason its in bears is its not eledgable for historic racing or a log book or something like that. and that castol 6 hour report was from the 1984 race held at oran park and concidering they were rideing production bikes its not really relevent at all. Mal Campbell's effort in beating Gardner during the 1985 swan series was far more spectacular. |
There are those who do, those who used to do and those who never did..
why is this 3rd group always trying to convince everyone they know best? |
|
|
|
matcho mick
Advanced Member
New South Wales
570 Posts |
Posted - 28 Oct 2004 : 11:46:54 PM
|
Acotrel,are the big grid entries through combining classes?,you mention 500 classic/postclassic grid?,or did you mean to say grids?, |
|
|
|
acotrel
Advanced Member
Victoria
2147 Posts |
Posted - 29 Oct 2004 : 08:00:27 AM
|
some of the large grids have been as a result of combining classes, some are not. The programme has been optimised to get the greatest number of rides while still catering for every historic class.
the BEARS rules are available at You must be logged in to see this link. Machines with Japanese notors are allowed to run as long as the frames etc are British, European, or American. E.G. includes Moto Martin, McIntosh, Egli, Rickman, JapAuto, Seeley, Rob North, Hyde. |
Is your machine authentic or merely eligible? |
|
|
|
john
Forum Moderator
Victoria
3130 Posts |
Posted - 29 Oct 2004 : 08:41:32 AM
|
So when has New Zealand become part of Britain. They were thrown out of the special deal with England when the poms joined the European Community.
Maybe we should let some Singapore bikes in as well, then the Indian Royal Enfields. |
John Daley Sidecar #68
' there are those who do, those who dont do and those who undo. We must lampoon the latter." |
|
|
|
john
Forum Moderator
Victoria
3130 Posts |
Posted - 29 Oct 2004 : 08:47:39 AM
|
So how many events are going to be Championship events.
Riders deserve to know what is happening before they leave home. In WA one championship did not go ahead because one entry did not actually front, people were very unhappy.
So with the reduced fields at the 2004 Champs, there may be classes with fields which are not big enough to sustain a Championship.
Al, you have explained the fields have been pushed together to increase the grids, so what are the field sizes in each class.
People have entered a Championship, they dont wont to get there and find the field is too small, they deserve an opportunity to withdraw with a refund if that is the case. Hopefully they will race for the fun of it, but natural justice would give them that opportunity.
|
John Daley Sidecar #68
' there are those who do, those who dont do and those who undo. We must lampoon the latter." |
|
|
|
acotrel
Advanced Member
Victoria
2147 Posts |
Posted - 29 Oct 2004 : 12:45:00 PM
|
| John, I suggest you ask Winton that question. I won't be there again until next week, and I don't know the answer. |
Is your machine authentic or merely eligible? |
|
|
|
john
Forum Moderator
Victoria
3130 Posts |
Posted - 29 Oct 2004 : 3:45:17 PM
|
| Sounds like a good idea, we shall do that. |
John Daley Sidecar #68
' there are those who do, those who dont do and those who undo. We must lampoon the latter." |
|
|
|
Former Member
deleted
120 Posts |
Posted - 29 Oct 2004 : 7:42:42 PM
|
| I reckon alan c does know the answer and i reckon quite a few more people should be saying what they know. we've been told that there is no sidecar chamionship for any class, when is alan c or the winton mob gonna have the guts to tell people. just how many classes have been shelved and isnt it funny that by the time they get told they wont have time to get a refund, yesterday i thought this meeting was gonna turn out okay in the end, because the guys racing werent going to let winton or ma screw somthing importantant to them, now i'm not so sure. |
Jayne |
|
|
|
john
Forum Moderator
Victoria
3130 Posts |
Posted - 29 Oct 2004 : 9:58:22 PM
|
I can say that I have heard that people here are trying to throw as much help as they can to at least have as best a meeting as possible, given that the numbers are down. At the end of the day we all want a great three days racing over the weekend of Nov 6 /7, despite the language preceding the date.
Whilst not all may agree with the circumstances it really is up to us to do the best we now can and go racing and maybe argue about things afterwards. I am aware some will be disappointed about non - championship events, I dont have a workable solution to that issue at the moment.
It really is in our hands to make the most of this opportunity and move on from here, lets do it!
|
John Daley Sidecar #68
' there are those who do, those who dont do and those who undo. We must lampoon the latter." |
|
|
|
matcho mick
Advanced Member
New South Wales
570 Posts |
Posted - 29 Oct 2004 : 11:53:47 PM
|
does the phrase "speaking to a captive audience" ring any (alarm) bells folks?,and of course competitors are going to make the best of it,(what choice do they have?),thats what a competitor does?,as for doing something about it later,yeah right,i preferred to vote,(with my feet)earlier,having perceived where Wintons focus lies,
ps think your'e right snoozer |
|
|
|
Alan
Forum Moderator
Western Australia
353 Posts |
Posted - 30 Oct 2004 : 12:20:43 AM
|
John is right we do have to make the best of what is not a normal situation for us. Obviously Winton rather than supporting the sport have just seen this as a very viable way of filling a date on their track calendar.
If I had given more thought to everything I would have kept my bike out of the container and stayed home but having sent the bike and payed for my air fares, accomodation etc etc I will be there. Next time I will not be so keen and will cut my losses.
At least this gives us from WA the chance to check out the logistics for next years big move to Tassie.
On a brighter note I did talk to Heather at Winton today and confirmed my race no. and found her to be very helpful.
Alan, confused, disappointed and hopeful |
|
|
|
john
Forum Moderator
Victoria
3130 Posts |
Posted - 30 Oct 2004 : 07:31:58 AM
|
Macho, To be quite frank we could go to the track and continue to express our dissappointment in such a manner that everybody gets riled up, we find fault with many things, we just repeat ourselves, everybody gets angry,we decide not to focus on the racing nobody enjoys themselves and some could feel satisfied with contiuing the dissent.
I have seen it happen before a few dissentters start shouting and abusing, the crowd gets wild, people react and all hell breaks loose. Some people get off on causing trouble, and generally they are never around to help with a solution, we all know we are unhappy about the situation.
Do we need to make it harder for ourselves on the day?
Or we can accept that we wish things were different, that some have learnt from this experience, go to the track, get on with racing and enjoy ourselves.
Then we when we get home satisfied we did get on with things, we then start to press for the 2005 championships. |
John Daley Sidecar #68
' there are those who do, those who dont do and those who undo. We must lampoon the latter." |
|
|
|
Former Member
deleted
120 Posts |
Posted - 30 Oct 2004 : 8:18:24 PM
|
| Crash goes another lot of class's, weve just been told that there is no championship for any 125's whatsoever. It seems the truth is something that winton and Ross Martin know nothing about. Is someone gonna say if 250, 350, and the rest have classes. All were getting told is the bears/kawasaki races are going well. and confused alan, i'm glad the old bird from winton was so helpful, pity she wasnt helpful in doing her job and telling you earlier that because of the way they stuffed up the organising and promoting of this meeting you dont have a chanpionship. |
Jayne |
|
|
|
Alan
Forum Moderator
Western Australia
353 Posts |
Posted - 30 Oct 2004 : 10:25:52 PM
|
I have to say that it doesnt look so good but regardless our container is already in Melbourne and we are still coming. Visit our garages or go to the same pub as us in the evenings and you will find a bunch of blokes enjoying themselves either because of or in spite of the organisers. however it all pans out we are stuck with what we have so we may as well get together and try to make it work for the long term benefit of our sport.
If it does turn out to be a disaster which I doubt, we should then put pen to paper while the points are fresh in our minds and write to MA and its Commission and in a rational way let them know our problems.
One question for you snoozer, are you saying there isnt a class for Period 4 sidecars? My understanding was that there were just enough.
Alan |
|
|
|
Former Member
deleted
120 Posts |
Posted - 30 Oct 2004 : 11:46:09 PM
|
| I hope your info is spot on alan, it would be a disaster if posty sidecars didn't have a championship, were going on the info we got i hope its wrong, but with a week to go why cant someone confirm things. |
Jayne |
|
|
|
john
Forum Moderator
Victoria
3130 Posts |
Posted - 31 Oct 2004 : 09:10:19 AM
|
Has anybody seen the Winton Forum,
www.motorsportforum.net.au/forum/viewforum.php?f=30 |
John Daley Sidecar #68
' there are those who do, those who dont do and those who undo. We must lampoon the latter." |
|
|
|
Alan
Forum Moderator
Western Australia
353 Posts |
Posted - 01 Nov 2004 : 12:36:21 AM
|
I am lead to believe that there will be a few disapointed riders, me being amongst them due to the lack of entries leading to not many Championship classes and I have also had confirmation from a Vic based rider who has received final instructions who will be getting 5 rides, not the 3 that were in the original programme. Maybe this has been brought about by combining non championship events and freeing up some time.
Only a week and it will all be over and all the questions will have been answered.
Alan Sidecar 21 WA |
|
|
|
john
Forum Moderator
Victoria
3130 Posts |
Posted - 01 Nov 2004 : 06:56:27 AM
|
| Alan with the concern about numbers, perhaps you could enquire as to whether the local shop could have a stand at the circuit to help out. Also, have you thoughtabout asking them to consider staying open longerhours to provide a potential service to those who may need a thing or two. |
John Daley Sidecar #68
' there are those who do, those who dont do and those who undo. We must lampoon the latter." |
|
|
|
Alan
Forum Moderator
Western Australia
353 Posts |
Posted - 01 Nov 2004 : 10:58:48 PM
|
John, according to the Final Instructions numbers will be available at the track. I havent received mine in the mail yet but did by email from Heather the other day.
My info is that dear snoozer is maybe better informed than myself as she is pretty spot on with the lack of Championship classes. Cant comment about the others as I dont have much info to hand but there doesnt appear to be any sidecar classes at all, pretty disappointing really when we in WA one of the smallest states managed to at least get Period 4 up as a class. Still as I said before those that are there will enjoy and those absent for whatever reason are the ones missing out.
Alan Sidecar 21 WA |
|
|
|
Topic |
|
Topic Locked
